Black and white film?

Hi, when i went to the store to buy my first safelight, the guy told me
that i can use this for black and white paper, but film can get ruined
by it because it is still sensitive to red light. but if i use black
and white film can i still use the safelight? i'm not very good at
doing stuff at the dark so i'd like to use the light if at all
possible.
thanx

Max

Re: black and white film?

It's a little early in the day to be drinking, Greg.

Re: black and white film?

Sometimes when loading reels, I "see" what I'm doing, quite literally. The
brain seems to create an image in my mind even when there's no light.
Unfortunately, it's not accurate. :)
Then, as you mention, I close my eyes and no longer "see" my hands, the film
and reel.
Strange?

Re: black and white film?

I've mentioned this before, but it never hurts to say it again. For those
people who have trouble loading reels, someone invented the "apron" tank.
An apron is a piece of plastic the same size as a 35mm roll of film,
with bumps on the top and bottom. You just remove the film from the
cartridge, wrap the film and apron together and put them in a tank. In a
previous post, I pointed to a picture of one from the 1950's, and later
someone pointed out that Freestyle still sells them.
Obivoulsy it has to be done in the compelete darkness, such as a changing
bag.
For those that can not work in a changing bag, or do not have enough
ability to use both hands to work an apron, Kodak made a day light
loading developing tank, where you thread the film onto the reel in
daylight, and turn a large knob. They still are available on auction
sites.
I find that I have much less trouble loading a reel if I keep my eyes closed.
If you can not work in a changing bag, but can't locate a daylight
loading tank, you can always use a windowless room or closet. It works
best at night with all nearby lights turned off and the door sealed with
a towel. Works best with low speed film.
If it really is a problem, don't bother. Just buy a chromogenic film,
such as Ilford XP-2 or one of the Kodak products (if they still make it
the one without the orange mask) and have it developed, but not printed
by your local one hour lab.
Developing prints in a tray, is IMHO far more fun than developing film
in a tank. YMMV.
Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel gsm@mendelson.com N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 Fax ONLY: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/

Gsm@mendelson.com (Geoffrey S. Mendelson

Re: black and white film?

"Peter Irwin" <pirwin@ktb.net> wrote
Nope, film is sensitive to all light. I suppose you could
use night vision goggles, but it is easy to work in the
dark with a bit of practice. I find I can 'see' better in
the dark if I close my eyes: it fools my brain into thinking
I am concentrating on the task at hand rather than that I
am lost in the dark. Go slowly and pay close attention
to how things feel, be very deliberate in your motions.
I have trouble loading film if my hands are damp. I
keep a towel handy when loading film on warm days.
If hands, film and reel are all completely dry then loading
is easy and fast. As Peter says: practice in the light; in
the light with eyes closed; and then in the dark until
you get the feel for it.
Try and load the reel in the light with damp hands just to
get experience with a jamming reel.
I have a light tight container at hand when loading film.
If the film doesn't load smoothly I put it in the container
and come back later in the day and try again. Once the
film gets damp/sticky there is no point trying to force it
on the reel, let it sit for a few hours to dry out.
The group rec.photo.darkroom is the place to go for more
help on the subject, though I hazard half the folks on
rpd are also on rpe35, the other half being on rpelf & rpemf.
Message is now cross-posted to rpd.
--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Darkroom Automation
http://www.nolindan.com/da/index.htm
n o lindan at ix dot netcom dot com

Nicholas O. Lindan

Re: black and white film?

While B&W paper does not expose to a red safe light; B&W negative film
will expose to a safelight (as the "guy" told you).
You typically develop the B&W negative in a light proof tank (after
loading it in complete darkness and closing the tank) in normal room
light. Practice with a "waste" roll of cheap old film in normal light
until you get the routine down ... it is quite easy.
If your "dark room" has fluorescent lighting, wait a few minutes after
turning them off before unspooling the film onto the reel.
Cheers,
Alan.
--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
-- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch.

Alan Browne

Re: black and white film?

Rollfilm is almost always developed in a light-proof tank.
The only time you need complete darkness is the minute or
so it takes to open the film canister, load the reel and
put the reel in the tank and close the tank. The tanks
can have liquids poured in and out freely without letting
any light reach the film.
I would recommend a plastic Paterson tank for a beginner.
If the reels are bone dry, they are very easy to load
in the dark. You will still want to practice several times
with a piece of junk film before attempting to load a film
that matters in the dark.
Peter.
--
pirwin@ktb.net

Peter Irwin

Re: black and white film?

...
No. He was talking about black & white film....It is sensitive to red light,
because you can take pictures of things with red in them, and they turn out
OK. You will have to develop your film in absolute darkness, even if it is
just black & white film. But there are photographic papers that are not
sensitive to red light, so, once your b & w film is developed and in your
enlarger, you will be able to use a red light in your darkroom while you are
exposing your paper in the enlarger without the red light fogging it.